ATTN: people who are making maps that we don't play

Discuss siege map projects.

ATTN: people who are making maps that we don't play

Postby Laser on Wed Jun 26, 2013 3:26 am

The reason we play nar so much is not just because it is a great map.

Upon first release, duo forced the issue on numerous occasions. He made a few betas which we helped him test, and it was regularly pugged because he'd personally make sure it wasn't going to waste.

No one knew the objectives at first obviously, so that's not really an excuse. It's a simple map which does help, even simpler than korriban.

My point is you guys have made so many maps, and some of them look really good, but I have never seen a genuine pug on the vast majority of them. Some people are too lazy to download the map, and a lot of people just refuse because they can't really play siege, they can just play hoth. These people don't have to play, they don't play nar either and that doesn't hurt most pugs.

Force people to play your maps a few times so a general opinion can be formed. Get on xfire and distribute it yourself if you have to. Nar is played more than some of the base maps, and there's no good reason why, if a similarly fun and competitive map is created, that it can't be the same for you.
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Re: ATTN: people who are making maps that we don't play

Postby aradorasxeon on Wed Jun 26, 2013 6:46 am

Well I'm trying, magyk trys to help me. In KTR you guys helped me a lot that's why so many versions were made. In the end (1.72) we pugged it once, maybe with 3s. To be honest I like the map, it look great for a first map (not counting that two room I made before this, one of them was a totally no shader room, and the other had 6 different textures) I loved to make it, maybe there are above 100 hours in it. I listened most of your advice, but in the end somehow most of the pepole never really wanted to play it, maybe because you didn't have to make the objectives in order, it was too big innovation, especially in a dying game. It could be better with not 3s but at least 10s or more. And there's that nasyt bug, that when you are in walker, the rancor totally ignores you, and same with the rancor's route. You may not know it, but it supposed to be circling around in its arena. Both of them is some problem in the AI programming, I realized this when I first had a look on desert and korri map files. The rancor supposed to circle around in its arena, and around coffin.

In UWB I totally made the objectives strict, my biggest problem was being too realistic and classes were off, turrets paradise was too much. (In the final version I've weakend the turrets, maybe a bit too much, but I did, well I never know, we never played it again). I loved UWB's design I think this was the first and only map played underwater, and maybe first siege map about a prison break out. I even made that big snper war field in the end, it was maybe too easy for snipers, and noone really noticed those explosion boxes which were scripted, and you could see first time in JK (I think) You could shoot the gas tank, and then boom, explosion, and flying (!!!!) away boxes, and those fires were put out later, because they had nothing to burn on, but well in this time it's not really a big deal. The endrun with the sunset lighting really looked beatiful in my opinion, but well we played that even less then KTR. (p.s. among siege maps on jkhub.org this map has the 2nd most downloads over 35, well I forced you guys to download it from there, but that can be around 12 top so there were 18 people who liked the pictures at least and gave it a shot)

Project Digimon, my latest map (probably final version) I have big hopes. Here I realized I would have bigger popularity if I made this one a lot like hoth. My idea was really about that channel at the begining and then just some random idea. The 3rd objective is most likely hoth's hangar, and the last is most likely hoth's cc. I even used hoth classes, because everyone know them well, and you can keep it in base, and well... making new classes can be mentally painful. At least I don't have to balance it. Well this is my first map where only one serious suggestion was made, to move first D spawn somewhere else (so I did), they said make objectives rush proof, I made them (I was thinking about it originally), and supra said to make an alternate way to database, well I didn't do that, because of the structure of the map it's almost impossible, and I think you can defend it this way as good as if i made one.

So now you have encouraged me I may become a dick and refuse to play unless it's p_D. I already gave up on KTR and UWB, but not on this.
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Re: ATTN: people who are making maps that we don't play

Postby Laser on Wed Jun 26, 2013 8:34 am

Next pug we're playing p_D

Maybe some of your ideas were too elaborate and not mainstream enough.

But it would be wasted effort if we didn't play your map so go for it.
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Re: ATTN: people who are making maps that we don't play

Postby Magyk on Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:21 am

We DID do a three's pug on p_D about two days ago, and gave Xeon some pretty heavy feedback about a few things - specifically the first objective, which was previously nigh impossible to offense (and has since been changed.) The new version we played yesterday (just 2s), and it was pretty good - perhaps needs a few tweaks here and there, but it played pretty well.

I'm not sure why people are always so hesitant to play newer (or even older) custom maps. A few of them are admittedly rough around the edges, and lack the visual polish that makes Nar feel more or less like a base map - but I don't think that makes them bad maps, or any less fun. In fact, I think a lot of them (especially Xeon's) are really innovative with unique objectives we've never seen before (like killing a Rancor, or having an optional objective to release Wampas to fight for you)

In my mind, there are FIVE maps which we are not playing as regularly as we should:
1.) KTR (probably needs some finalized tweaking, but its impossible to tell without pugging it.)
2.) p_D (same as above)
3.) Castle Siege (I think Mikeh just has to fix an issue with being able to saber through walls and walk through a gate.)
4.) rdm1d (IMHO, this is the best custom map we have available to us. Jerk did an outstanding job with this map.)
5.) tie_test (This is also another really good effort by jerk, but I'm not sure how it would play with less-than-4s.)

UWB, while definitely fun, is probably the farthest from completion. But I don't think I ever played the newest release of it, so who knows - what i do know is that the final "escape across the bridge" objective where you run across that huge bridge that hangs over the ocean is one of my favorite siege objectives ever.

Also, for the record, almost every map is uploaded to Paddy's: including things like Endor, and Mygeeto. Some of these maps are kind of laughers because they aren't particularly well designed or are stacked in the defense's favor (*cough* Endor *cough*) but I don't think that means we can have any less fun on them. Some of them have really cool objectives (ie; Endor's "capture three of four crystals") It would do us good to get off of Hoth more often.

Laser wrote:and a lot of people just refuse because they can't really play siege, they can just play hoth.


This is a great line.
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Re: ATTN: people who are making maps that we don't play

Postby Turquoise Dragon on Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:58 am

Magyk wrote:
Laser wrote:and a lot of people just refuse because they can't really play siege, they can just play hoth.


This is a great line.


Pretty much. Hoth's fun, but I make maps to try and mix that up.

Also make maps more or less for my own amusement. If people play, great. If they don't, I still got to play around making it.

siege_castle needs final tweaks (as mag pointed out).
siege_flying_fortress needs visual work (and maybe class balances), but is playable last I checked. Then again, I messed withsomething on my radient version and it won't compile as of yet, so I'm not 100% sure how well released version plays. I'll check that sometime....
siege_korriguns is in kinda the same boat, as the visuals are horrible (mostly texture fixes), but quite playable.
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Re: ATTN: people who are making maps that we don't play

Postby Laser on Wed Jun 26, 2013 11:03 am

What a waste of genuine talent and creativity if we don't play these maps
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Re: ATTN: people who are making maps that we don't play

Postby Caesar on Wed Jun 26, 2013 12:07 pm

I downloaded all of the maps above, except KTR. There are so many versions I just decided to ask , which is it? I like random siege map, tie test is alright, castle is tons of fun, P_d is a ball, and korriguns is really fun. (provided we ever pug it)

Random question: Laser who is that in your sig?
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Re: ATTN: people who are making maps that we don't play

Postby Turquoise Dragon on Wed Jun 26, 2013 12:37 pm

Laser wrote:What a waste of genuine talent and creativity if we don't play these maps


In a way, yes. At least in terms of the mapmaker deriving their pleasure only from seeing the maps played. Would still like to at least mess around on some of them just for the hell of it every so often. A week (or two?) ago, me, c, and mag went through endor and mygeeto, then started to run through h3h until we decided to go offline. Fun stuffs...
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Re: ATTN: people who are making maps that we don't play

Postby Laser on Wed Jun 26, 2013 12:43 pm

Turquoise Dragon wrote:
Laser wrote:What a waste of genuine talent and creativity if we don't play these maps


In a way, yes. At least in terms of the mapmaker deriving their pleasure only from seeing the maps played. Would still like to at least mess around on some of them just for the hell of it every so often. A week (or two?) ago, me, c, and mag went through endor and mygeeto, then started to run through h3h until we decided to go offline. Fun stuffs...


From my own and community's selfish point of view I meant :)

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Re: ATTN: people who are making maps that we don't play

Postby aradorasxeon on Wed Jun 26, 2013 12:50 pm

Caesar wrote:I downloaded all of the maps above, except KTR. There are so many versions I just decided to ask , which is it? I like random siege map, tie test is alright, castle is tons of fun, P_d is a ball, and korriguns is really fun. (provided we ever pug it)

Random question: Laser who is that in your sig?


1.72

http://jkhub.org/files/file/1284-kill-the-mutant-rancor/
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